Talk:The Sundays

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Biography: Musicians

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Discussion

Has any band ever remade "Here's Where the Story Ends"? If so, then who?Jaberwocky6669 03:44, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)

Tin Tin Out --UK

Flowchart (from their hollow sky ep) --Ciotog 06:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Faye Wong (singing a loosely translated version in Cantonese) --Ciotog 06:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Indie band The Bellows (from the tribute compilation "Our Finest Hour") --Ciotog 06:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Brandon Milner (spoof: "Here's Where the Bar Tab Ends" as Stinky Breath Jenkins, also from "Our Finest Hour") --Ciotog 06:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

A number of songs have been registered under Harriet Ella Wheeler with US licensing group BMI outside of the official releases. They are as of November 29, 2006: "Gib Mir Den Wein" (written by Bruce Low), "Leave My Money Alone" (by Teddy McRae), "My Mood" (with Eve Morris), "Nonsense or Intelligence" (by Sidney J. Wyche), "Spanish Town Rhumba" (by Sam Taylor and Leo Stephens), "Thanks for the Roses" (by Sidney J. Wyche), "Why Did I Cry" (by Leo Stephens). All are published under the name "Wheeler Music Co.", and are predominently jazz songs from the 40s and 50s.

Picture

This page didn't have a usable(free from copyright restrictions)picture so I added a painting I did of Harriet. I don't know if this constitutes original research though. My expectation is that it will be replaced with a picture that:

1) Comes from a fan who took a photograph and is willing to release it free of copyright restrictions

2) Comes from the band or their management angered over this picture representing the band

Until then, I hope its presence here will force someone to get on it. I will then delete my painting at that time. Slffea 01:47, 6 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

On February 13th, 2007, I removed my image. I did not want to, but after a lengthydebate, I decided it wasn't worth trying to convince an admin and another editor why it should stay. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Slffea (talk • contribs) 07:26, 14 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Article style

This article really doesn't rise to the neutrally informative quality of a typical Wikipedia article. It reads a lot more like worshipful liner notes. Can someone please tackle a rewrite?

Jim Jiminee

I added a "dubious" tag to the reference that Harriet sang with Jim Jiminee, simply because other than this one reference which has been repeated elsewhere, no evidence exists to back it up. For example, Harriet is never attributed on ANY Jim Jiminee album that I've seen (not that I've seen many). The female singer in Jim Jiminee was Delphi Newman, who's voice is clearly different from Harriet's. Perhaps Harriet was a backup singer during some period of Jim Jiminee's history, but I'd like to hear from someone with direct experience to back this up. Ciotog 11:33, 30 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Her work for Jim Jiminee probably happened before they recorded an album. This is probably true of other bands Harriet was in so it's still worth putting in the article. For instance, she says in Melody Maker Dec. 5, 1992, page 34:

The B-52's: "Planet Claire" (from "The B-52's") "THIS is the album with all the fantastic handbags on the front. I played this all the time when I was in my late teens, although I don't know how I can rank it with the other records because it's so sort of ..stupid. But I listened to it tons at the time. I really liked the way the girls shouted in harmony. My older sister and I briefly sang backing vocals in a hippy covers band and we used to stand on stage gigs at the local mental homes with our fingers stuck in our ears, trying to sing like Kate and Cindy. Did we go down well? At the mental homes, almost invariably yes."

I doubt we'll ever get a recording of her at that time, but I would still include it in any article of Harriet if I ever wrote one. You could say it has more credibility because it is a direct quote, but we don't know the sources of "Guinness Encyclopedia of Popular Music"(which in some ways makes Wikipedia better), so it's hard to say. I also think the "Guinness Encyclopedia" is a reliable source.

Also, from Melody Maker, October 11, 1997, page 20, talking about bands Dave and Harriet had been in:

Both were once in Joy Division-worshipping bands. Dave's was called The Odd. Harriet was in a school band called...Aerial Coffin!

Again, I think both are worth including in an article even though there's little chance of getting albums of these bands with either of them mentioned.Slffea 20:11, 30 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Also, Lindsay Jamieson, who was a member of Jim Jiminee, played the tambourine on Reading, Writing and Arithmetic which you can see on the back cover.Slffea 22:47, 30 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, certainly you would expect just about every band member in any internationally recognised band to have been in various "school" bands. I don't know how noteworthy the bands would be, however - who was the base player for Aerial Coffin, for instance?

I don't think these bands are noteworthy or even exist anymore. That's why I haven't included them in the Sundays article. But I would put this in an article of Harriet because it tells us interesting things about her. She and her sister are both singers so she may come from a musical family. She enjoyed singing enough that she was willing to sing to the insane or mentally disturbed. She was/is a big enough fan of "Joy Division" and the B-52's that she sang in similar sounding bands. So these things are part of her musical education. Of course it may be original research to make these inferences, but the facts themselves certainly are noteworthy, at least for the trivia section.Slffea 19:36, 5 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Kevin Jamieson (Lindsay's brother) also toured with The SUNDAYS after the release of Static & Silence, and Nick Hannan of Jim Jiminee is Patch's brother. I'm not questioning that there are ties between Jim Jiminee and The SUNDAYS, but to say Harriet "was in the band" is a little bit of a stretch. I think it's more likely "Performed with Jim Jiminee at some live gigs, just for fun".

No offence to Kevin Jamieson, but I just can't imagine that The Jims would have passed up a chance to have Harriet as their lead singer :) Ciotog 13:20, 5 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I've also heard it said that the Guinness Encyclopedia is "Rife with typos and editing errors" ( http://www.spaceagepop.com/referenc.htm ). For example, it claims that Doc Severinson led the band that backed Merv Griffin, when it was actually Johnny Carson ( from http://www.amazon.de/Guinness-Encyclopedia-Popular-Music/dp/1561591769 ). What exactly does the encyclopedia say about Jim Jiminee? Stephen Thomas Erlewine's bio says that Harriet "...had previously sung with a band called Jim Jiminee", which doesn't necessarily mean she was ever an official member of the band.Ciotog 13:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In Guinness, the exact quote says, "Harriet, who had already gained prior singing experience in a band called Jim Jiminee". This then brings up the question of what it means to officially be part of a band. If you sang with a band for a year and then quit before they recorded an album, were you part of the band? Some may say yes, and then some say no. What would Pete Best say about this? Was he ever a band member of the Beatles? Regarding the Griffin/Carson switch, this is a big error but it seems more a case of confusing 2 famous talk show names. The Jim Jiminee reference is very specific information.

"Jim Jiminee" has a myspace page. Maybe someone can do some original research and get details from them on what Harriet's involvement was.Slffea 19:36, 5 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Heck, Lindsay Jamieson has a myspace page: http://www.myspace.com/albj Ciotog 21:44, 5 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Has this research that was suggested been done? Beause if not...there still is NO reliable source for this information. Until such time as her involvement can be attributed to a reliable source (and mentioned by name), it should be removed from the article. NickBurns 16:07, 18 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Singles

What about the other singles, When I'm Thinking About You and Wild Horses? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 170.142.158.4 (talk) 17:59, 12 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

did The Sundays really cover Toto's "I'll Be Over You"?

I've heard the song online but when i google it, no one seems to have proof that it's really them playing Budurski (talk) 13:31, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No, that's definitely not them. I've heard it, and it's absolutely not Harriet singing. Plus, the guitar playing sounds nothing like David.

Prologue

Does anyone know enough about the 2009 album "Prologue" to add info on it? Is it a different group entirely maybe? Jstohler (talk) 20:27, 16 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No, it's some J-pop band. Snied (talk) 12:26, 1 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Rewrite

The sea of ^{[citation needed]}s is a pretty good indicator that something isn't quite right with this article. I intend to change it quite drastically soon, and as half of the article is inappropriate content that will mean rewriting most of it. The article will probably become a lot shorter as a lot of the existing material doesn't have a Wikipedia-compatible equivalent. If you have any objections now would be the time to register them! Snied (talk) 00:06, 19 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what happened to you, but I have removed the fancruft, hear'say, bollocks etc. As you noted, this leaves bare details, but at least it looks like an encyclopedic article not a fansite love-in.

Derek R Bullamore (talk) 14:33, 31 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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friends from college

I add the line 'and in the episode 01x01 of the serie "Friends from college" (2017)' — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.6.31.122 (talk) 21:39, 10 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Origin

In an interview from March/April 1990, Wheeler said the band formed in Winter 1987 in Bristol. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.108.216.87 (talk) 14:13, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Merge Proposal

I've proposed merging Harriet_Wheeler with the Sundays because

1. She gets her notability from her work with The Sundays

2. She's not notable for any other work

3. The Harriet Wheeler page accordingly has mostly information about her singing and songwriting with the Sundays that can be transferred or is already on this page.

U2fanboi (talk) 15:25, 3 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Agree: She's never had a career outside of The Sundays, so it doesn't make sense for her to have her own page. And since she and her co-writer/guitarist in the band are a couple, it makes sense to put any relevant family-related stuff on that page, too. -- Hux (talk) 00:17, 9 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Theme music to Newman and Baddiel

In the Static and Silence section, 'the only appearance of the band' in fact also included the teased use in Sept 1993 - well before release of the album - of mostly instrumental sections of the demo for 'Another Flavour' as the title music to Newman and Baddiel in Pieces https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnWl7Jm5IT4 - Theme music credited to The Sundays.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.184.110.210 (talk) 13:22, 3 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]